Talk:Ishmael
Ishmael is Chico. 23:25, September 2, 2015 (UTC)23:25, September 2, 2015 (UTC)~~ Echowdha (talk) 03:59, September 3, 2015 (UTC) Merge with Big Boss suggestion While it may be right to merge / redirect to big boss, It's too big of a spoiler to do so immediately I propose to wait a month (October 1st) before doing so. Jestersage (talk) 20:46, September 2, 2015 (UTC) There is no such thing as a big spoiler for me. This information is going to spread fast so we might as well merge the 2 arcticles. We should do it ASAP. One month? This is the 2010's, when information can spread worldwide in less than two hours. We should have merged the pages yesterday afternoon. Might as well just do it, since the page now has "It has been suggested that this article or section be merged with Big Boss." at the top of the page, which has the same effect in terms of spoilers. Just merge the pages you practically gave it away in the page title, and most people nosing around wikis don't care about spoilers anyway I don't think it should be merged. Snake's false idenity Plisken had it's own page. Liquid Ocelot still has his own page even though he is Revolver Ocelot. So I don't see why Ishmael shouldn't have his own page. Rvb forever (talk) 16:28, September 9, 2015 (UTC)Rvb forever Okay, so, why hasn't this been done yet? This isn't a gaming blog or forum; we shouldn't concern ourselves with hiding spoilers and such from inquiring eyes. If credible and verifiable information has been released, such as Ishmael being Big Boss, then we should revise our articles ASAP to show that. And like one anon above stated: "Most people nosing around wikis don't care about spoilers anyway." The merge proposal tag is honestly one of the biggest, most blatant spoilers on the wiki at the moment anyway. It's doing more harm than good, so, we should hurry up and reach a consensus. 02:31, September 10, 2015 (UTC) Venom Snake got his own page which is a huge spoiler but is logical. Psycho mantis was merged with the Third Child. Eli was merged with Liquid Snake. So why isnt ishmael merged with Big Boss? The merge tag gives it away already. Yeah, I agree. I mean, we already have a seperate Venom Snake page with major spoilers right at the get-go, so I don't really see the point of trying to conceal spoilers at this stage. I guess they just view it as too daunting of a task. NO. No reason to combine the pages at all. The purpose of Ishmael itself is to disguise the fact and a major plot point of MGSV. I am already in the process of trying to get the admins to replace the VENOM SNAKE Artical on Ground Zeros Back to SMF Medic. Revealed to the "world" or not does not mean that these story elements should be so openly revealed. There are better ways to give information then huge open paged spoilers. :By your logic, we should split the Iroquois Pliskin and Solid Snake pages back to separate articles specifically because their being the same character is a very major spoiler. Weedle McHairybug (talk) 12:37, September 15, 2015 (UTC) I agree to merging the page into the Big Boss one. As the game itself makes perfectly clear, Ishmael and Big Boss are the same person, so there's no point whatsoever in not unite them. As Weedle McHairybug noticed, if we don't merge them, by logic any character which had at some point another identity should be separated in different pages, which is insane other than completely illogical. Sincerely, I know everytime a new MG is released here is a mess, but come on, don't tell me you really think the purpose of the Wiki is not give a full detailed information about every topic treated in the series? Because that's exactly the purpose of the Wiki. Which means that stuff like "you stupid that's a spoiler cut it out" lacks any logic. Seriously: does split Iroquois Pliskin by Solid Snake, Jack the Ripper by Raiden, George Sears by Solidus Snake, Unnamed MSF medic by Venom Snake, Null by Gray Fox, Black Ninja by Kyle Schneider, Naked Snake by Big Boss, Big Mama by EVA (I better stop here, this could go on forever) make any sense to anyone? This is Metal Gear Wiki, not a speculation/random fan-made forum. An encyclodepia about Metal Gear. Ishmael shouldn't be any more than a redirect to Big Boss, as there's no way to deny that they're not the same person (in case wasn't clear, it's official). It's the same story of *rolling eyes* "discussions" such as "PO is non canon because Kojima didn't write it, who cares if he says it is". Those are just hot topics that should be treated with a much more calm attitude, or else we'd end up doing nothing but keep arguing about everything but the point, deleting each one's edits and not caring about the sources but giving up to just what we want things to be, making the purpose of the Wiki completely vanish. Can't we actually discuss and leave our personal expectations of the characters out of the Wiki pages, using the Forum instead? The question of Liquid Ocelot is different (although I am too in favor to merge it to Revolver Ocelot), and should be discussed elsewhere. Sincerely. --The 2nd travel of the Titanic (talk) 16:48, September 18, 2015 (UTC) I'll point out some key things here about Ishmael that makes it so he isn't Big Boss. But then again, it could just reinforce that he is. : 1. Ishmael has two functioning eyes. : 2. When BB and Ocelot meet, it is at dawn, but Ocelot is shown boarding the tanker with Venom earlier than that. : 3. Ishmael is visibly shot and killed three separate times. : 4. The only pieces of "evidence" that the BB in Mission 46 is the real BB are that he smokes real cigars, has only one strap on his eyepatch, and talks more - all things that Kojima himself said meant nothing. : 5. Kojima lies, but he has never before directly removed content from a game that was shown off publicly before release - including a sequence of Venom riding BB's motorcycle, wearing his clothes. Conclusion: Mission 46 is either a hallucination or a deliberate lie. Alternately, Kojima really dropped the ball and wrote an absolutely shit ending. I do consider that possible, because that ending was beyond shit. Shit-tier shit. Not even a nice fat satisfying shit, but the liquid kind that just makes you itch because you can't wipe all of it off. -With love, DarkWolfInsanity 10:05PM September 30th, 2015 (CDT) Kojima removed the tanker sinking scene with Snake running away from the flood in trailers for MGS2. He's done things like that before. And scenes of Big Boss in the helicopter looking at the camera with blood and dirt on his face from other trailers didn't make the cut either. Ishmael could've been wearing a mask JUST like how Kojima wore a mask with fake eyes when presenting the first GDC trailer. And Ocelot could have taken BB away and had him hide as he went to get Venom and take him to the port. There's nothing that concretely shows that Ocelot stayed with Venom in the port the entire time. He could've left and met up with BB. - Bacon 3:50PM October 3rd, 2015 (CDT) :In all fairness, the bet about Snake running away from the flood in MGS2 WAS in test demos, but it got cut because it was uninteresting. Not to mention it WAS kept in the actual game as flashbacks for the Tanker Incident. Weedle McHairybug (talk) 23:54, October 3, 2015 (UTC) :Its been a month now, this page should be merged with big Boss's page.